Posts Tagged ‘Voice Over’

Flipping the Script on Audio Description Part Two – Voice matters

Wednesday, November 11th, 2020

Continuing with the question; When it comes to Audio Description, are we listening between the lines?

In this episode I’m joined by some extremely talented Voice Over Artists who are also lending their voice to some of your favorite Audio Description projects.

Allyson Johnson, Bill Larson, Inger Tudor and Tansy Alexander.

Each of our guests have more to say than what’s on the script

How important is voice? Not just the quality and tone, but what else is implied by what is heard? Is the voice indicative of an entire group of people. Can a woman’s voice fit a specific genre of film? Is there really a Black voice? Let’s flip the script and find out.

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Transcript

Show the transcript


— Music begins – pulsating bright funky beat!

TR:

Greetings! Welcome back to another episode of Reid My Mind Radio.
The podcast bringing you compelling people impacted by all degrees of blindness and disability.

Audio: The beat comes to a stop after a record scratch “Hold Up!” DJ Cool from “Let Me Clear My throat”

I need to jump in with an amendment to my opening in order to acknowledge that yes, I should have posted this episode last week. However, last Tuesday was Election Day in the U.S and I just didn’t feel like it was the right thing to do.

Maybe it was an over analysis on my part, but if anyone actually missed the episode, I apologize. I just wasn’t in that space.

then yesterday, Saturday November 7, my wife yelled down to me, they called it for Joe!

Music: “A Brand New Day” The Wiz

So we took some time to celebrate and for a moment at least feel hopeful!

— Breathes in deep and exhales

That really does feel good!

Now back to my original opening.

Bring that beat back!

— DJ Scratch and then the pulsating bright funky music resumes!

Today we continue Flipping the Script on Audio Description and focus a bit on voices.
You can say voice matters. Or Voice Matters! Voice, matters!

Audio: Reid My Mind Radio Intro

#Intros

Inger:

My name is Inger Tudor. I am an African American woman , middle age, we’ll leave it at that. And I live in Los Angeles. I am a Voice Over Actor, I also do film, theater, television. I do some hosting, announcing and all that kind of fun stuff. Is there anything else you wanted me to tell you?

[TR in conversation with Inger:]

Did you say Audio Description?

Inger:

I didn’t because I was like oh that’s the assumed, but you’re right, I do Audio Description and audio books too.

— Music Begins – Upbeat Hip Hop beat

TR:

Earlier this year I had the chance to speak with several talented AD Narrators. I’ll tell you exactly where you heard them but go ahead and see if you recognize the voice or name.

Tansy:

Hi I’m Tansy Alexander. I’m a Caucasian woman. I’m five foot seven, I have Auburn hair. I’m very athletic and active. I do all variety from narration to audio books, to commercials, promos trailers, IVR phone systems. I’ve done pretty much it all.

Bill:

My name is Bill Larson I actually am a Voice Over artist. I do commercials, I do different types of announcing and so forth.
And I also do Audio Description.

Allyson:

My name is Allyson Johnson. I have been a professional Voice Artist for about 2 3 years. I’m about five foot five, a hundred and five to a hundred and seven pounds, I’m pretty thin. Now see here’s when I need an actual Audio Description writer because there so much better at this than I am. I read what they write and I think that is fantastic, but if I have to write it I’m like how do I describe my skin tone. Well, it’s kind of I would say, cafe ole. If you took coffee and you put a whole bunch of half and half in it, that’s my skin tone. I have people would say dark blonde, some people would say light brown ringlet curls. I wear glasses there like a brick red and black modeled polymer plastic frame. What else? Are there things that I’m leaving out?

[TR in conversation with Allyson:]

No, no you probably did more than most did. (Laughs) That’s why I left it vague, I just want to see what you do. Laughs.

Allyson:

Laughs… So that’s me!

TR:

Well, there’s way more to her than that! And we’ll get there, but first I know what you’re thinking. Thomas, that’s messed up, you didn’t ask Bill to describe himself.

He’s sort of off on his own.

Bill was one of the earlier interviews and the idea was not presented until after. However, stay tuned I’ll be sure to ask him more about himself during our conversation.

Each of our narrators share a few things in common. They’re all experienced Voice Over Artists who have either acting backgrounds, radio and even a bit of television. Of course, they each have great voices and know how to use them.

Inger Tudor used hers as a DJ at her college radio station. After graduating Harvard Law she put it to use as a litigator.

While working at a mid-size law firm in Boston, Inger was in conversation with another attorney who side gigged as a studio musician. She asked Inger an important question.

Inger:
What is it that you like about law?

I told her what I liked and why I wanted to be a lawyer. She said,
(– Music ends.)
you like acting in a courtroom, go act. You’re not married, you don’t have kids you don’t have a mortgage do it now, because you’re going to wake up and go okay, I want to do it and you’ve got all these things that keep you from doing something you can actually do. I thought about it and I prayed about it and I was like you know what, she is absolutely right!

TR:

She began taking classes and working in the field. This included voice acting. Boston happened to be a good market for her to get her start and SAG or Screen Actors Guild card. This gave her greater access to opportunities. Moving to New York city gave her even more. By the time she moved out to LA she was acting full time and no longer doing any law related work. Staying in touch with a playwright helped lead to her first AD opportunity.

Inger:

About five years ago he contacted me and said oh, I forgot that you do voice over. Would you come in and audition for me. I work in a department where we do descriptive narration for film and television.

TR:

And today!

Inger:

I do a lot of recording for the Media Access Group which is a subsidiary of WGBH the PBS station out of Boston.

TR:

Tansy’s introduction to VO felt more like that Hollywood story.

Tansy

I was out with my friend who did Voice Over, my friend Steve. We were at lunch at a restaurant and we were chatting about Voice Over and other things and a few minutes later a gentleman came over, a very distinguished gentleman, and said, do you do radio or voice over and I said well, not yet but my friend is trying to tell me to do it. He said well when you’re ready give me a call. He’s one of the partners in Abrams Rubleoff.

I never did sign with them but things did go from there because that was the impetus I needed to take it seriously and get things going.

TR:

And indeed things started going. Tansy intro to AD came after volunteering for a radio reading service in Los Angeles.

Tansy:

AIRS LA.

They would have us reading articles out of magazines and so forth then I decided since I am an actress as well to cover the entertainment portion which was really fun. I did that for a few years and then out of the blue this other opportunity came around not related, to continue to be of service to the Blind community through doing Audio Description.

TR:

Allyson’s first AD project came through her friend who owned a post-production company. He was approached by the producers of another film who were interested in including AD on their film and wondered who would be right to narrate. Why not an audio book narrator, he thought?

Allyson:

My first Audio Description was for the movie that he was working on which was the major motion picture Arrival. I left that session and I thought this is fantastic. I sort of went on my own journey and found Audio Description Training Retreats in North Carolina, Jan and Colleen who teach this wonderful program. That’s how I learned. It was within the year of me doing that film.

TR:

Bill’s introduction to AD?

Bill:

It was by accident. I used to work at Best Buy. We had this demonstration room where you could go in and experience what a home theater would sound like.

It wasn’t working right. We actually had a Blue Ray in there to demo for people but to get the normal audio that you would hear on a Blue Ray to play you had to cycle through at that time all of the other audio channels; French German, Chinese, the whole bit. The last track was Audio Description. When I heard somebody’s voice start to speak; (in his AD Narrator delivery)

“A plane flies over head” I listened to this and I said I need to do this. This is important.

[TR in conversation with Bill:]

Do you remember what movie that was?

Bill:

Yes I do, Kong, Skull Island.

TR:

Bill grabbed some more DVD’s and researched more about AD. He learned of the American Council of the Blind AD Project and headed out to the conference that year.

Bill:

That conference was in St. Louis that year. I was lucky enough to meet people who do and produce Audio Description. Did a demo for them and the rest is history.

TR:

Voice Over and AD fall into the entertainment industry which definitely has a history.

Allyson:

When I started out in this business, when I was still doing demo tapes on cassette, the sort of common acceptance was you would do a demo tape without your photo on it for the most part. Certainly in commercial voice over world which is where I started. They didn’t necessarily want to know what you looked like and you as the voice talent didn’t want people to know what you looked like either because you wanted them to make a decision about whether or not to cast you based on your voice. If you already been cast in something you wanted the listener to be able to create their own image of who you were based on what you sounded like so it sort of wasn’t relevant what you looked like. In some ways it could be either distracting or could give someone the wrong idea because sighted people tend to make very quick judgements when they look at someone. And if you don’t look like what you sound like in the voice over world that’s a whole other kind of issue.

Bill:

I have worked with different casting people and they look at my picture and have their own preconceived notions of how I sound.
[TR in conversation with Bill:]

Could you describe yourself?

Bill:

Are you of age to know Al B Sure?

[TR in conversation with Bill:]

Yeah!

Bill:

(Singing)

“I can tell you how I feel about you night and day!”

[TR in conversation with Bill:]

Laughing… I’m keeping this!

Bill:

I know you are, that’s alright though.

(Singing in his Al B Sure impression)

“Oh, Girl!”

Al B Sure was the bane of my existence in high school. Oh my God you look like Al B Sure.

TR:

If you don’t know Al B Sure, well he’s an R&B singer from the 80’s. He was something of a heart throb who had lots of female fans.

In case you’re listening Al, don’t worry Bill isn’t planning on leaving his day job any time soon.

Bill:

I have worked very hard on my voice. First of all I come from Chicago. I had to work the Chicago out of my voice, but at the same time I wanted my voice to be universal. I didn’t want somebody looking at me and making an assumption about me and that actually speaks to what’s going on right now in the world. I don’t want them to say oh well he looks Black so he must sound Black so I’m only going to give him the voice work for Black actors. I know the business enough to know what sound somebody is looking for for something. I would never, never ever say to use me if my voice is not appropriate for something.

TR:

Bill recalled one particular time when he went out for a role that helped him come to an understanding.

Bill:

Because of how I looked they wanted me to sound more ethnic. They didn’t want me to be my natural self. Because my natural self sounds like this. I am a bi-racial Black man in this country. There is no denying that. So when you see me as they did, they saw a voice in their head that was counter to how I actually speak. the product I thought sounded like crap because I was trying to be something that I wasn’t based on the notion of what they wanted me to sound like. I wasn’t me I wasn’t my authentic self. But more than that, there are other actors out there especially actors of color, announcers of color who would have given them exactly what they were looking for. So I thought to myself I’m never going to do that again. When you’re in this business, you’re always looking for work , I just don’t ever want to take the work out of somebody’s hands who could deliver what somebody’s vision is.

TR:

The goal of a fair selection process is to remove pre-judgement and create a system based on merit. In Voice Over that means the best voice for the role wins. Yet that’s subjective from the start. Meanwhile we know there are many ways to pre-judge.

Inger:

Inger is Scandinavian and Tudor is Welsh. There usually not expecting someone African American. Depending on who I’m talking to and how I’m talking, they can’t necessarily tell what ethnicity I am over the phone. It can become a funny thing or sometimes a frustrating thing.

TR:

Although not specific to the sort of Voice Over acting she does today, Inger shared a story about a time when she interviewed for a telemarketing position. Let’s be honest, the best telemarketers are truly acting!

Inger:
The initial interview was over the phone because they need to see how you sound. I’m talking in my corporate voice and how I would talk if I was talking to someone for a survey or what have you. I show up for the first day of training. Actually it happened to be a fairly diverse group of people but they couldn’t figure out why I was there. I said Oh, I’m here for the job interview and they all look at me like well who are you? I said I’m Inger Tudor and then I literally see like five or six heads all turn to each other with this look like what, huh? And I went “Ya, ya, you expecting someone Swedish, ya!” (Said in accent) So they all started laughing, because they were!
My name can work for me or it can work against me. Knowing my ethnicity can work for me or against me.

TR:

If we really think about it, the impact goes beyond the individual.

Voice Over agents for example. Pre-judgements can limit opportunities not only for the clients, but also the agents as they receive percentage of the work they find.

Inger freelances with two separate agents.

Inger:

One of them only brings me in for Black Voice Overs. the other one will bring me in for things that are a lower register or someone that’s middle age or an authoritative voice. Things that fit the type of characters I would play. And they bring me in for the Black characters as well.

TR:
Casting a project is often more than just voice. A narrator familiar with the culture for example, can provide insight into a project that those outside may have never realized they were lacking.

Allyson:

I did the Audio Description for If Beale Street Could Talk. What a glorious film that was and the description was so beautiful. I think it was the description for something that Regina’s character was putting on or taking off. Something with her hair.

TR:

Here’s a culturally competent moment for you. Those in the know, heard that and paused. Those who don’t know, well, we’ll just get back to the conversation.

Allyson:

I don’t know what the word was that they used to describe it but I was like I don’t know what that word is but that is not what we would call it and I don’t think anyone who’s listening to this would understand what you mean when you say it.

— Music Begins – slow dark Hip Hop beat

[TR in conversation with Allyson:]

Now you said that’s not what we call it. Who was the we; women, Black women?

Allyson:

I think in that situation it was Black people.

TR:

Issues of race and identity aren’t new, right?

Allyson:

There were no phrases like bi-racial, nontraditional casting, ethnically ambiguous. We didn’t have ethnically ambiguous back then (laughs) I mean we did because I am it but we didn’t call it anything.

[TR in conversation with Allyson:]

(Laughing) Right!

TR:

A natural extension of voice acting especially for commercials is on screen acting. The casting process there often begins with the image. If you’re interested in auditioning for a specific role, well your look will need to match the casting director’s or any other decision maker’s perception of that role.

Allyson

Whatever the category was they thought I might fit in, I probably wouldn’t fit.

Voice Over made more sense to me because nobody was necessarily thinking about it.

TR:

Necessarily!

Allyson:

They would use phrases in the specs like we’re looking for an urban – urban was always buzz word. It’s like ok, so you want Black.

In terms of Audio Description, I have been hired to do Audio Description for shows that are primarily dealing with Black topics or set in a place where the majority of characters on the screen are all Black. And I know that I’m being hired because they want a person of color to do the Audio Description. So in that sense it does play a factor that I happen to be a Black Audio Describer. It’s more of them just wanting to be sensitive to the content and to the material. You and I both know everybody needs a little bit more representation.

##Tansy:

And if I may broach this subject, I do think that we need to see more inclusiveness on the narrator side.

I get plenty of work, but I still think there’s a gender bias in the industry for males to succeed.

It’s the same it’s been for the whole spectrum of Voice Over since I started over twenty years ago, the belief that a male will sell it better. For whatever reason; the voice will cut through or people listen more to a man than a woman. These are stereotypes that probably aren’t true at all. These decisions to use a man or a woman are extraordinarily subjective.

TR:

Narrating for over ten years, Tansy had the opportunity to help in the early stages of multiple AD production companies.

Tansy:

I used to do a lot of action, landing on the moon, war movies, I’ve done a few last year. I can do a romantic comedy, I can do a children’s thing, I can get in there and get gritty. But all of a sudden they decide oh well for all the Marvel we need to have men.

TR:

Tansy noted some growth in opportunities expansion with the advent of female lead characters.

Bias we know goes beyond race and gender.

Bill:

I am double the man I used to be. (Laughs) So there was a time when I lost a tremendous amount of weight. But I don’t look like that anymore. When you’re in the professional acting and voice over field it’s best if you don’t misrepresent yourself. Now a days they call it Catfishing. If you’re cast for something based on an old picture and when you get to set and they realize you are double the size or your size card is out of date or your voice changes, then they’re probably going to dismiss you and not hire you again. I know how I sound. I want people to hire me. (Pause) And I love the look on their faces when I walk in the studio too. (Laughing )

[TR in conversation with Bill:]

Laughing

TR:

Representation really is serious business.

Have you ever really considered who you expect to hear narrating action movies or thrillers versus dramas or romance films? What about those films based in or on communities of color?

. For closing arguments I’ll call the litigator.

Inger:

Yes, we should be voicing the characters of color, but don’t Ghetto-ize us and make that the only things you give us to do. Cast me also because of the quality of my voice. If you’re looking for something that has a particular quality and ethnicity is not important to what the character is then I should be considered as well as a white actress. You shouldn’t just assume that it has to be someone white if that’s not important to the story.

TR:

I know some people hear this and say, why should it matter? Shouldn’t anyone with a suitable clear voice just be able to voice characters or narrate films no matter their race, ethnicity, gender etc.?

Inger:

Hold on a minute. Four hundred years, we haven’t had the opportunity to do a lot of stuff, take a seat for a moment because I guarantee you your seat for a moment will not end up being four hundred years. Then when we get to the place where everybody can do everything that’s fine, but we’re not there yet and we need to catch up so give us a minute, ok?

[TR in conversation with Inger:]

There it is!

— Music ends with a base drop that pulsates and slowly fades out.

TR:

Did you recognize anyone? Here’s some of the projects our narrators voiced.

Allyson:

Arrival was my first. It sort of made me realize what I now know I like about description. The guys who wrote that script were not “Description Writers,” but they were the sound guys. They knew that movie backwards and forwards. They’d seen it over thirty times so they knew what was important to put in the copy. I only know that now looking back.

Audio: Allyson narrating Queen Sono

TR:

Allyson also narrated If beale Street Could Talk and can be heard on Queen Sono on Netflix.

Just this past spring, ESPN premiered The Last Dance. A documentary about The reign of the Chicago Bulls in the 90’s. I’m not really a sports fan, but I do love a good sports documentary. Unfortunately, it did not include AD. That is until it was released on Netflix this summer.

Audio: Bill narrating The Last Dance

Bill:

being from Chicago, growing up in that time knowing that the Bulls were that championship team and we had two three peats. That was amazing to me.

TR:

It just so happens, Bill has a connection to sports.

Bill:

If you happen to attend a Philadelphia Eagles football game, I’m one of the in stadium announcers there.

I’m not announcing the game, that’s actually the guy next to me. We’re not on radio, we are in stadium only. Whenever the teams go to a TV timeout, that’s when I speak because people in the stadium hear commercials or see promotions and I announce those.

TR:

In addition to The Last Dance on Netflix you can hear Bill on Money Heist and Project Power.

Audio: Inger narrating Hanna on Amazon Prime

If you’re familiar with The Neighborhood, Amazon’s Jack Ryan, Proud Mary or Once Upon A time in Hollywood then you probably heard Inger as she narrated these projects.

Audio: Tansy narrating See on Apple TV

Did you recognize Tansy’s voice?

As I mentioned to her, technically this is her second time on the podcast as her voice opened my episode with Joe Strechay and his involvement with Apple TV’s See.

Tansy:

Oh my God, well thank you, thank you very much. (Laughs)

Well, that’s interesting, ok, so now I have a question for you. If you watched See did you not know that was me by listening to me talk right now.

TR:

Ok, well, I didn’t. To be fair, yes, I could have had her full bio for the interview, but the interview wasn’t about specific projects. Tansy Alexander has voiced hundreds of projects over the years including Orange is the New Black, Stranger Things and she’s even doing live narration for the WWE. or World Wrestling Entertainment.

When I asked her if any stand out she struggled a bit but mentioned one

Tansy:

Switched at birth series.

We are doing a show with Audio Description but we’ve got a daughter in the show who can’t hear so we got sign language going on. We also have to describe any sub titles. It’s all fascinating how it works together. One of the episodes was completely done in sign language, so there was no talking what so ever in this whole episode so we had to bring in other people to do some of the reading of their sub titles because I couldn’t do them all it was just too many. It would sound stupid nobody would know what’s going on.

TR:
Having people know what’s going on is important to Tansy.

Tansy:

A person who is not able to see what’s going on is left out of the discussion. You can access the show but you can’t access the whole content. It’s not fair. I’m about equity.

[TR in conversation with Inger:]

Why AD? Why do you enjoy Audio Description? And I’m assuming you enjoy Audio Description.

Inger:

Oh, I do actually!

It’s a number of things.

One, I’ve always liked reading aloud. It was actually how I got into acting was in grade school, when we had to read aloud in class I would get so into doing it and giving the different characters different voices that they started sticking me in plays.

When you have the opportunity to see how it effects people like when you actually have an audience or if you’re reading to a group of people, you can gauge how your words are affecting them. If you change the tone, change the pitch, if you change the pace. What that does to how they’re receiving it, how they’re taking it in how they’re being emotionally effected by what you say.

TR:

yet, there’s little immediate feedback in Audio Description.

Inger:

I like the aspect of knowing everything I’m doing in terms of entertainment or acting just being about being on stage. There is some part of it that you want to be service, you want what you’re doing to help somebody in some way. Whether you’re helping them to see something different about themselves or about how they view the world or particular groups of people or what have you. One of the things I appreciate about the descriptive narration is you feel like you’re at least doing something that you know directly helps a particular group of people have access to something that they might not otherwise have access to. To being able to more fully enjoy a television show or a film because you’re describing the action that’s going on. So it’s one of those areas where you can feel like you’re entertainment and service are merging.

Bill:

I take this very seriously and I want you as a consumer of Audio Description to know that. Audio Description is a responsibility. Someone is watching this movie or this TV show. If you don’t take that craft, if you don’t take what you do seriously enough then the person who’s listening to it is not going to have a good experience and they’re marginalized even more. Just because it’s provided doesn’t mean it’s very good. And I always strive for it to be good.

— Music begins – A driving upbeat Hip Hop beat

TR:

Ladies & gentlemen, join me in saluting:
Allyson Johnson;

Allyson:

My social media handle is the same on everything @AllysonsVoice And that’s AllysonsVoice (spelled out)

TR:

Mr. Bill Larson

Bill:

On Insta Gram @BillIvoryLarson. Hit me up! let’s have a conversation.

TR:

Tansy Alexander

Tansy:

There’s links on my website TansyAlexander.com. TansyAlexander (spelled out)

And last but definitely not least, Inger Tudor. By the way, during the pandemic Inger began a cool project during the pandemic. The name really does capture the mission.

Inger:

“A Poem A Day Art and Love in the Time of Corona”

TR:

She continues to bring you exactly that. Every day a new poem read aloud. You can find it on her social media, Facebook, twitter and Insta Gram all @IngerTudor.

Inger:

IngerTudor (Spelled out)

TR:

Occasionally she’s even dropping some of her own original work.

Inger:

If you do check it out feel free to leave a comment about a poem or a poet or a topic you would like me to do a poem on.

[TR in conversation with Inger:]

Oh, you’re taking requests? (Laughs)

Inger:

I take requests!

TR:

As do I! Ahem!

— Music ends.

Four Voice Over Artists
Become Narrators for what we know as AD
they get interviewed for a podcast
And now become Reid My Mind Radio Family!

Audio: Air Horns

Audio: “It’s official!”

TR:

I salute you all!

— Music begins – A driving upbeat Hip Hop beat

TR:

Subscribe wherever you get podcasts!
Transcripts & more are over at ReidMyMind.com. And , you know I told you this before and I’m going to tell you every single time… ReidMyMind.com is R to the E I D
(Audio: “D and that’s me in the place to be” Slick Rick)

Like my last name.

Audio: Reid My Mind Outro

Peace!

Hide the transcript

Viewing Audio Description History Through Audio Eyes with Rick Boggs

Wednesday, May 6th, 2020

Audio Eyes LLC Logo - graphic of film transforming into brain waves with the text "Turning pictures... into words"
Continuing with the exploration of Audio Description, I’m very happy to have one of the founders of Audio Eyes, Rick Boggs on the podcast. We get a bit of a lesson on the history of Audio Description with an emphasis on the role Blind people played in its creation and advances. Why is this important? How can we be proactive in promoting AD? How can we become more than consumers of AD?

Listen in as Rick doesn’t hold back sharing his thoughts on the problems with AD, Blind consumer organizations and more.

Listen

Resources

Transcript

Show the transcript


Audio: Crash Crew Hi-Power Rap.
“We don’t want to be left behind, all we want to do is just blow your mind, just one more time!”

Instrumental.

TR:

What’s up Family!
Back again! Bringing you more of what you bargain for. Reid My Mind bringing you the baddest guests and topics we can find!

We are here to tell the world, just who we are.

I’m Thomas Reid your host and producer of the podcast featuring compelling people impacted by all degrees of blindness and disability.

Every now and then when I’m inspired, I bring you some of my own experiences as a man adjusting to becoming blind as an adult.

Audio Description is and will continue to be an ongoing topic on this podcast. it makes sense. We focus on those adjusting to blindness. Audio Description in my opinion, is a part of that process.

Its access to information, entertainment, bonding with family and friends and maybe even career opportunities?

If you’re new here, check out the link on this episodes blog post that has a page with all of the podcast episodes featuring Audio Description.

Today we’re looking at the contributions of Blind people in Audio Description. Let’s get it!

Audio: Reid My Mind Theme Music

RB:

I needed a job as a young guy, 17, 18 years old. I have many, many as most Blind people do, many grueling stories of discrimination. Just in telemarketing to sell the local newspaper here in Los Angeles and I don’t mean the LA Times, They hired me on the phone. But then when they told me to come to their office and were giving me directions they were vague. I said would that be the second building from the corner? They said, don’t worry about it just come down the street you’ll see the yellow sign. I said well, I don’t think my guide dog will notice the yellow sign. They said your what? Wait a minute, put me on hold for 20 minutes and came on and made an excuse; “Oh you know what, I didn’t understand my partner was also interviewing someone on the other line. We already filled the position.”

I’m Rick Boggs, professional Audio Engineer and am responsible for making Pro Tools, the state of the art audio recording software accessible for Blind Audio Engineers. I’m also a musician, playing multiple instruments. I’m a composer and song writer. Something of an accomplished actor. many appearances on television and film between 1987 and 2007. And for the last 20 years I’ve been operating the company that I founded which is called Audio Eyes and we produce Audio description for film and television.

TR:

As you can see, Rick came a long way from that 17 year old young man in search of a job.

Today, we’re specifically exploring Rick’s career within Audio Description. As he has been involved with the industry for over 20 years, we get a bit of a history lesson on the role Blind people played in Audio Description.

Rick’s own introduction to Audio Description, from my understanding illustrates how many people felt at the time.

RB:

When I first heard of Audio description was when the American Foundation for the Blind was conducting their research and creating the booklet that eventually became “Look Who’s Watching”. Where they surveyed Blind people and asked them if we could add a voice to TV programs describing what was on the screen when no one’s talking would you like it?

No, I feel very independent. I can watch TV all by myself. I don’t need some voice telling me what’s going on.

TR:

AFB’s next step was to invite a group of those surveyed to watch a film.

RB:

I think it was a Forrest Gump film with Vince Skully doing the description.

TR:

The group was then re-surveyed.

RB:

90 percent of the people who said no, like me, changed our mind and said well actually, this is really cool and I didn’t realize how much I was going to enjoy it. I would like to have this.

TR:

No, like he really liked it!

RB:

In 95 and 96 when WGBH, which is now Media Access Group, they were installing Audio Description systems in movie cinemas. they called me because I was very visible on television at the time. they figured I would be a good representative of Blind people and they asked me to find other Blind people to come to these events. I helped recruit Blind people to come to their installation celebrations and then of course the media would come. I was interviewed on cable news and broadcast news, talking about what the value of Audio Description was. I became a volunteer promoter and the face of WGBH.

TR

This was in addition to his actual career at that time.

RB:

From 1987 to 2002 I had a record label and recording studio. I built a recording studio from money I had earned as an actor. My desire to get into audio recording was driven by my passion as a song writer. I wanted to be able to record and produce my own things mostly because I couldn’t afford to go to a bunch of other studios and hire a bunch of musicians, so I wanted to be able to do it myself.

TR:

And he did. He produced bands and song writers in his studio located on his residential property.

Doing it yourself can present very specific challenges .

RB:

That led me down the path of the transition from analog audio to digital
I wanted to make sure that we weren’t left out. That’s a long and interesting story of how that ended up happening.

TR:

For now, we’re focusing on another sort of accessibility.

RB:

Then moving forward to 2002 when my good friend Mike Hansel who at the time was working for Caption Max, he came to visit me and my good friend Jack Patterson. We were in the music studio and he was coming over to play drums and we were going to jam and he said, rick, I don’t get it, how come you’re out there promoting this Audio Description stuff. You’ve got the studio and you got the chops as an engineer and all the equipment to produce and you’re not producing any. I was just stunned.

Well, I guess I never thought of that.

I immediately said let’s look into that. maybe that’s not a bad thing to do.

TR:

Even today, when we discuss Audio Description, it’s more than often from the perspective of a service FOR Blind people.

During my conversation with Rick, it was apparent to me that Audio Eyes should be viewed from a historical perspective.

So let’s go back to the beginning of Audio Description.

RB:

Well this is one of my favorite topics, I have to tell you. I’m so proud to say that United States of American has invented many, many , many things and has held many, many patents. And many of the things we’ve created and invented benefit people with disabilities, but normally those things are created, invented, delivered by people that don’t have that particular disability. Hey we will help those that are less fortunate kind of thing. What I’m proud to say about Audio Description is Audio description as created by Blind people. And every innovation and advancement in Audio Description that has really contributed to what it is now was made by Blind people.

TR:

According to The History of Audio Description, written by Joel Snyder, the idea of Audio description in its current form was first conceived in the 1960’s by Chet Avery, who lost his sight at 17 years old.

In 1981 Margaret Rockwell, a blind woman with a PhD in Education decided to pair the assisted listening devices with her future husband, Cody Pfanstiehl. An expert in media and public relations, Pfanstiehl read for the Washington Ear, the radio reading service founded by Rockwell.

RB:

Cody and Margaret, their gone now, rest in peace, but they set the standards for how description should be done so that it’s not condescending, so that you’re not explaining the plot. And they trained some people.

TR:

One of those trained was Allen Woods who continued training others in the Pfanstiehl method.

RB:

Another Blind person, a wonderful guy that I know, Jim Stovall, created the Narrative Television Network, NTN. He set out to try to apply Audio Description to television programs And in 1989 he worked I believe with WGBH, a television station, to demonstrate how it would be done. They used the SAP channel that was originally devised by Congress and the FCC to facilitate foreign language broadcast. They demonstrated it successfully in 1989. Jim received an Emmy actually for technical achievement.

TR:

During the 1990’s the only television network broadcasting Audio Described content was PBS.

RB:

Commercial TV wouldn’t do it no matter how much we pushed and advocated. They resisted.

In 2002, the FCC made a rule that commercial broadcasters would have to do three and a half hours of prime time described programming on their network. That’s how I got my start and some of the other companies got there’s

TR:

In hindsight, it seemed obvious. Rick familiar with recording technology was already promoting Audio Description and learning the business.

With his good friend Jack, Rick formed the first iteration of Audio eyes known then as We See TV.

RB:
I was invited by my good friend Jolene Mason who is a Blind person who should receive a lot more recognition than she has for her contributions to Audio Description. She insured that the Tournament of Roses parade every New Year’s is described live on television for Blind people. And has done so since the mid 90’s at least. Putting that on through her nonprofit, the Los Angeles Radio Reading Service.

Well, she invited me to a meeting with Deborah Shuster.

TR:

Deborah Shuster did the captioning for ABC television. She was approached about creating Audio Description for the network.

RB:

Deborah having the integrity to realize that Audio Description was not her forte and she didn’t know it was going to go look for a company that was good at it because she cares about providing good services in the industry, unlike some people who were caption companies who just said let’s just throw something out there and call it Audio Description. No one will know the difference because no one knows if it’s good or bad anyway, which we’ll get into at some point.

TR:

That meeting led to him describing for ABC television.

In 2007 Rick renamed the business.

RB:

Same company, same service same people and everything, but it became Audio Eyes.

We secured various clients and now we’re on as many as 9 broadcast networks, Amazon, iTunes, Netflix. Large venues and many corporations that produce corporate videos and so on.

The Pfanstiehl’s created it and trained sighted people to do it. Jim Stovall put it on television and GBH took it, but it became sighted people doing it without any input.

Yet another important stage in the development of Audio Description was made by another wonderful professional Blind person, Dr. Josh Miele.

TR:

Long time listeners should be familiar with the Smith-Kettlewell Physicist Dr. Josh Miele. He’s an alumni of the podcast and a member of the Reid My Mind Radio family. I’ll link to his episode on this episodes blog post.

RB:

He has developed a lot of really cool adaptive stuff for Blind people, but he was interested in description. He found that there was a grant available through the Department of education which he applied for initially.

He did the impossible, he brought together all of the major providers of Audio Description services and created the Description leadership Network under the Video Research and Development Center. the legacy is its website VDRDC.org

TR:

It served as a resource on Audio Description related information and provides a communication platform where leaders in the field discuss topics like inclusion.

As Josh too is a proponent for the inclusion of Blind people in the Audio Description production process he began an internship program.

RB:

Paid internship so that any description provider, who’s writing description could experiment with having a Blind employee and not have to have a financial risk for whatever the time period was three months, that any, six months and experience the value of having that person. The disappointing part of it was that really only one other vendor besides myself did it. I shouldn’t say one I think it’s technically two. One of them absolutely did take on the intern as a staff member for whatever the period of time was. The other one simply contracted with a Blind person as a third party to review their work after it was already done. It’s a little different to have a Blind person critique your work when it’s already out there on television as opposed to give the Blind person the opportunity to have input before its finished.

TR:

As for the company taking on the Blind intern, the feedback was positive. Full of praises for the intern and admitted to it being a mutual learning experience.

RB:

Josh had the great courage and integrity to ask well then does that mean going forward you would consider maybe employing the Blind person in your process. And there was a long silence and the person answered by saying. Well, we think maybe it will be a great idea since there’s so much work going on the internet right now, these Blind experts could volunteer their time helping companies that providing description on YouTube and other places on the network. The whole room kind of ooo’ed!

Maybe in an unintended way it sounded very much like they were saying that they should work for free.

TR:

Meanwhile back at Audio Eyes…

RB:

Our staff is now 30 people and it started with just two of us back in 2002.

Our desire was to provide the best quality description out there. And we emulated WGBH who was doing the best Audio Description. The only difference was we were going to be inclusive. We were going to make sure performers with disabilities had opportunities to work in it and Blind people in particular would always be included in the company. We would recruit, find train Blind people to work in production and we’ve always done that.

[TR in conversation with RB:]

You have 30 employees, can you talk about how many of those are Blind/disabled?

RB

Seven staff members that are totally Blind. Actually one guy might be qualified as Low Vision but it’s pretty low. (Laughs)

TR:

Rick was active as an advocate within the Screen Actors guild serving as an alternate board member and co vice chair of a committee creating opportunities for actors with disabilities. This and possibly those early experiences in the job market, helped form his early hiring policy.

RB:

I was very connected to a lot of disabled talent. for the first two years I willingly practiced reverse discrimination. I would only cast Voice Over artists with disabilities. I just felt like there was so much discrimination in the industry. We’re never giving people with disabilities and opportunity. I wanted to make my statement. I boasted about it on the internet and I naively thought it would make other companies feel the pressure and they would start hiring people with disabilities too, but it didn’t work.

TR:

Now looking towards the future and how we improve Audio Description.

RB:

Making sure that Blind people have a voice; what’s good, what’s bad, what are the standards, what should it be. I was eventually invited to edit and re-write a lot of sections of the style guide for one of the major streaming services. The big dog in the industry. To their credit, they recognize hey this guy is the expert he’ the professional let’s take his notes on what our style guide should be about, what description should be.

[TR in conversation with RB:]

You mentioned that this was your favorite topic, what’s the importance of this topic? Why do you think it’s important that people are aware of that history?

RB

I think it’s really important that people understand Audio Description was created by Blind people for Blind people because I want the industry to be accountable to the consumer. I want the industry not to be like many services for people with disabilities which are well intending but also have unintended patronizing elements to the services they provide. In other words, making people feel less than, less powerful, helpless, creating a dual class system. Sort of treating the people you’re helping like they’re not really equal to yourself
.

TR:

Audio Description is not a charitable venture, it’s commercial. The need for inclusion is therefore even more relevant in my opinion.

Making sure not to leak any revealing information, Rick shared a recent experience. One of his Audio Description clients received some complaints about description from the general public.

RB:

(In a mocking tone)

What’s with this annoying voice? Why do you have to put that in here? We don’t like this. How can we get rid of it?

They decided to address it in the TV program itself. Which I thought was a unique decision. The comment wasn’t very flattering of description itself. It offended some of my staff who are Blind. To the customer’s credit, when we notified them and said you know this is offensive. They decided to change it. And kudos to that organization that was willing to do that and showed some sensitivity to their patrons and actually care about the feelings of Blind consumers.
[
[TR in conversation with RB:]

What are some of the other hurdles that seem to be in the way , “in the way” (laughs) of Blind people being involved in the production side of Audio Description

RB

Blind people are not loud and vocal about wanting good service.

[TR in conversation with RB:]

Talk about it!

RB

Blind people are all too often grateful to have anything. In recent online forums…

TR:

I’ll include links to these forums on Reid My Mind.com.
They include the Audio Description Discussion Facebook group and the ACB Audio description project listserv.

RB:

A lot of Blind people and describers are on there. Unbeknownst to the members of that group there are actually a whole lot of network executives and TV people that watch that group sort of lurk there. Someone was complaining because the description on a particular series or program was poor. They told us stuff we already know. They didn’t tell us stuff we wanted to know. Bla, bla, bla!

Now I love it when Blind people get up and go hey man if you’re going to describe it for me do a good job otherwise I’ll turn off the description and listen like I used to.

So the discussion was fruitful, it was very constructive. But then some Blind person, inevitably, comes on and says guys I don’t understand why we have to be complaining about the description that we’re getting. Can’t you remember the days when we didn’t have anything at all. I mean can’t we just be grateful that these people are providing something.

That is the most destructive thing that Blind people can possibly do.

TR:

I have a feeling this attitude exists in any marginalized group. Perpetuating the idea that Blind people should just be happy with what they get implies they don’t deserve quality.

RB:

I have been told by one of my customers. And a major customer at that. Rick we’d be happy to even pay increase rates for this stuff if we could verify that what you’re saying about the quality of your service is actually true. Basically, they said if you can point us online to anywhere Blind people are saying this is what makes good description and it lines up with the kind of service you provide Rick well then yeh, we’re not going to grind you on the prices as much as we do because we want to pay for the best service there is.

TR:

At the end of the day, are these really just excuses based on what they already believe to be true?

RB:

the public perception of blindness and Blind people is really inaccurate. And really flawed and really is the greatest barrier to inclusion of Blind people in anything. Anything at all! Social services, employment of any kind. From my perspective in particular in inclusion in Audio Description production.

TR:

Misperceptions that ultimately question the abilities of blind people. Assumptions that lead people to think it’s amazing that a Blind person can do even the most basic things that have little to do with the ability to see like brush their teeth, get dressed…

RB:

People trying to drag them across the street, talking loudly because they can’t see or all these stereotypical things that do happen to all of us. Those same misperceptions are the same barriers within the entertainment industry, that prevent production companies, caption companies, localization companies these post production companies from thinking about Blind people and considering employing Blind people in their operations. And I have story after story I have so much inside perspective and direct contact with people.

TR:

The type of stories, based on real experience, that can provide insight into the industry that we as consumers may otherwise never
know.
RB:

It really is far and away public attitudes toward blindness and Blind people. That’s why I became affiliated with the National Federation of the Blind. I always sort of walked the fence between that and the American Council of the Blind and been a member of both and participated in both. I appreciate the American Council of the Blind’s advocacy. It was there advocacy really that led to the FCC ruling in the first place in 2002 to make description mandated for commercial television. They really deserve the credit for that.

What I’m about to say may sound like sour grapes, but it really isn’t.

TR:

The difference between organization’s as Rick sees it conflicts with his own philosophy of employing Blind people.

It stems from the initial development of ACB’s Audio Description project.

RB:

Committing themselves to ongoing advocacy and promotion of Audio Description. They did not include a plank that would strongly advocate for inclusion from an employment perspective. I felt that they should have consulted me because I had already been employing Blind people in this field for eight years. they knew very well of what I was doing. And yet when they created this initiative they didn’t even call me to say hey do you have any thoughts on this or that or the other thing. As a result in my opinion, they failed to include the professional opportunities and the importance of inclusion in the process in their initial manifesto on Audio Description.

TR:

While he appreciates both organization, for Rick, the difference between the two is clear. The National Federation of the Blind…

RB:

In my view, walks the walk. When they needed a lawyer they hire a Blind lawyer. When they need a travel agent they look for Blind travel agent.

TR:

The two teamed up and Rick and his colleagues offered a training.

RB:

It was a 50 week intensive training program. To train 10 Blind people to become Certified Description Quality Specialist.

TR:

The NFB’s support not only enabled Rick to provide this training but it also helped lead to opportunities for those trained.

RB:

We found that we definitely had a like mind.

I would like to have the legacy that providers of Audio Description automatically seek to include Blind professionals in their own operations. We are really far from that now, nobody does that, but that is my goal. I eventually want to return to producing music and get out of Audio Description but I would really like to establish that first.

TR:

As far as finding ways we can help, Rick suggests that those with a platform, podcasters, YouTubers, bloggers, no matter what your topic is, find a way to include discussions about Audio Description.

RB:

Get people talking about it whether they’re Blind or not. Kind of introduce people to it that don’t already know it.

TR:

And from the consumer point of view, well let’s share our comments; good or bad.

RB:

And they need to get those comments directly to anybody and everybody. In other words; tell the network, you write to the show, and to the description company that did it. And then publicly on social media. On your FB timeline on your Twitter account. Hey saw a great Audio Description and name where it was and when it was. And why? I love the voice that they chose or they had a horrible voice or the mix I could hardly hear the movie the description was so loud. Whatever it is be vocal about it.

TR:

If you want to be vocal about Rick, well, he’s on social media;

RB:

@BoggsBlogs (spelled out) on twitter. Facebook at rick Boggs.

TR:

You can find links to his social and more by visiting AudioEyes.com. Remember, that’s plural
RB:

AudioEyes (spelled out)

TR:
Or…

RB:

Give us a ring 818-671-6190. We’ll take your phone calls. We’ll talk to people, sighted people, Blind people, Voice over artists. I take demos over the internet all the time. Any Blind person interested in getting involved in this kind of stuff, I’m the only way in right now. We’re pretty busy but I do get to everybody eventually, if you’re patient and persistent. And I thank everybody really, if you listened this long, thank you so much for your interest in the whole topic, really!

Shout out to Rick Boggs! I enjoyed this conversation. Audio Description as you hopefully realize is about so much more than entertainment. It’s adoption, the level of commitment given by entertainment producers and broadcasters is a reflection of how Blind people are perceived in society.

Scripts censoring on screen scenes or talking down to the viewer, expecting quality control work for free,
overlooking the contributions and minimizing input from Blind people…

That to me sounds like a statement about how much Blind people are valued.

As Audio Description evolves it becomes more important to understand and assure its original purpose is maintained. All the more reason for more Blind people to be involved in its development.

I personally suggest Audio Description to those who are not Blind, however, I would not want to see Audio Description move away from centering Blind people and possibly becoming less about making the visual accessible.

How do you feel about Audio Description? Do you like this sort of dive into topics? Let me know; ReidMyMindRadio@gmail.com or leave me a voice mail at 570-798-7343.

If you liked what you heard today, Tell a friend to check out Reid My Mind Radio. It’s available wherever you get podcast

Transcripts, resources and more are over at ReidMyMind.com. And yes, that’s R to the E I D…

Audio: (“D, and that’s me in the place to be!” Slick Rick)

Like my last name

Audio: Reid My Mind Outro

Peace!

Hide the transcript

Opportunities in the Creation of Audio Description

Wednesday, August 21st, 2019

As we continue looking at Audio description, we take a look at the opportunities for those within the Blind and Low Vision community to participate in its creation and not just as consumers.

Headshot of Colleen Connor and Guide Dog Joplin
Colleen Connor, co-founder of Audio Training Retreats & an Audio Description Quality Control Consultant is doing exactly that. We explore the challenges and some potential solutions, current ways to get involved and things being done to support future involvement from more Blind people.

Listen

###Resources

Transcript

Show the transcript

TR:

What’s up Reid My Mind Radio Family.

I had to take a little break from the podcast. I’ll explain more about that in a future episode as its directly related both to this podcast and adjustment to blindness.

This episode is actually being posted on an off week. So that means expect to get another next week. In fact the two sort of support one another.

We’ll be moving forward with episodes every two weeks after that taking us through the end of the year, with a break beginning some time in December.
For now, let’s get it!

Audio: Reid My Mind Radio IntroMusic

TR:

One question that I suppose is asked by just about anyone adjusting to becoming Blind as an adult, especially working age, is what sort of work can a Blind person do?

If this is your first time listening to this podcast, I’d encourage you to take a listen to the archives. We indirectly answer that question in many episodes where we profile different individuals most often impacted by some degree of blindness or low vision.

Today we’re going to continue with our look at Audio Description or what some around the globe call descriptive video. Specifically, the opportunities available for Blind and low vision people in the creation process.

To do this, I reached out to Colleen Connor. Colleen is a podcaster, web accessibility tester, Audio Description Consultant and Co-founder of Audio Description Training Retreats.

Diagnosed with Cone Rod Dystrophy as a child, Colleen lost most of her usable vision by her Junior year in high school.

CC:

I’m grateful to my parents because they didn’t treat me any differently. I’m a black belt in Tai Kwon Do, participated in school fully and never was held back from doing anything. And so you know I decided to super, super logically major in musical theater (Laughs…).

[TR in conversation with CC:]
Laughs…

CC:

because that’s so practical.
[TR in conversation with CC:]
What did your parents say about that, about that choice?

CC:

I think they just wanted me to be able to do what I wanted and what I was good at. They weren’t thrilled but they didn’t actively stop me. They knew how passionate I was about theater and acting and studying dialects and singing.

TR:

Colleen’s introduction to audio description isn’t what you might have suspected.

CC:
I ended up working in the Spy Museum in Washington DC. They had a described tour there but it was very out of date.

TR:

Guess what Colleen offered

CC:

Hey I’m visually impaired, can I update this for you. And I was too Naive to ask for money. Much like a lot of my work I did it for free.

I was in theater and musical theater almost my entire life and I had no idea that Audio Description existed. No one had ever told me about it. I didn’t know it was something I could ask for. Once I discovered the audio tours in museums someone mentioned to me about Audio Description of plays and musicals and live theater and I was blown away. And then of course I discovered that they were also doing Audio Description for film and television.

TR:

That project at the Spy Museum?

CC:

I rewrote this tour. I added some tactile elements. People were really impressed by it. I got hired by Cortina Productions after that to work on the audio tour of the George W. Bush Heritage Library and Museum in Texas.

TR:

Doing the work and having it well received is great, but AD meant more to Colleen.

CC:

This could be kind of my way back into theater. I started looking into it realizing that there isn’t a lot of training.

TR:

Maybe you’re familiar with the saying, get in where you fit in. That’s what Colleen did.

CC:

As those of us who can’t see we are the users of Audio Description. Therefore it’s my belief that we are your best source of quality control. We are your best source of feedback. One of the things that I started doing was critiquing people. So I would contact people whether it was from a live show or a TV show or film and I would say here are some notes about your description. I thought you did this well, I think this could be an improvement, I don’t think you should have used this voice artist. I started from a place of editing and critiquing.

[TR in conversation with CC:]

How was that received?

CC:

Sometimes it just straight up wasn’t. (Laughs…)
So my messages are somewhere in the ether, I’m sure. Other times people were amazed and then especially as far as live they were very hungry for feedback and critique because they do these shows and half the time nobody’s even listening to their description and so to get legitimate feedback. Some people have an ego about it they think they’re infallible but most of the time people are like thank you so much , what else.

So I realized in a sense it would be ideal if you have people teaching audio description or if someone was an audio describer to have a consultant who is visually impaired or blind who is a user of the experience.

TR:

While in the role of Quality Control Consultant during a conference, Colleen came across another opportunity.

CC:

I met my business partner Jan Vulgaropulos and she is a professional Audio Describer.

TR:

Jan, who specialized in live theater description had a question for Colleen.

CC:

Listen, I’m thinking of starting my own training. Would you do it with me and start a company?

I said yes, let’s do it lets create something new! We both decided that rather than a classroom kind of conference where you’re there for two days 8 to 5 with fluorescent lighting in a hotel trying to get the basics of Audio Description that we would create Audio Description Training Retreats, which is our company, and we would have people in sort of a natural environment . We would do courses in Audio Description . That has become part of my passion and my focus.

TR:

Back to the earlier question; what sort of work can Blind people do? In this case as it pertains to Audio Description.

CC:

I’m not only there to give the student’s feedback, I co-teach Audio Description. I help teach them about Disability awareness and the history of Audio Description, where it comes from. The update as to what’s going on now. We go over kind of our guidelines for helping people establish Audio Description.

And then my colleague does the actual description teaching. The main goal is to give people as much feedback and performance opportunity as possible. So we have our students do a lot of description.

TR:

The hands on approach enables these future describers to figure out what aspect of Audio Description they like.

CC:

Hey you know I like writing, but I don’t want to do the voice artist thing or I don’t think I could do live theater and just say what I’m seeing in real time that’s too hard. Or they might enjoy that challenge.

TR:

I don’t want to be one to say that something can’t be done based on the current process. It may appear that way until someone comes along and changes how it’s done.

Yes, right now, live description and writing the description for a film or television show requires sight. But wordsmithing doesn’t.

What are the other challenges for a Blind person to participate in this work?

How about narration?

CC:

When you are recording in a studio, what normally happens is the script is on one screen and then on the screen next to it the film or TV show is playing and it has the time stamps on it and the Sound Engineer will say ok you have three seconds to record this line will do it three times ready? And they will play the clip and you’re watching the clip and trying to say what’s on the script at the same time.

TR:

Ok, maybe it’s me but this doesn’t seem to be a real obstacle. It’s a process that’s currently in place but there’s no reason it couldn’t be done differently.
For example, a Sound Engineer could cue the Narrator.

A Narrator/Editor with time stamp info alone could easily run through and record and be sure that the narration falls as indicated.

CC:

I think if you were doing it independently you could be successful at it. I think some of the larger studios everything has to happen so fast in post-production that they’re like you have one day to do this. You have one day to record the Audio Description and they just don’t think Blind people can do it.

[TR in conversation with CC:]
Huh!

TR:

That sounds like the biggest obstacle to me, attitude.

CC:

As far as quality control, as far as the people who should be editing, I think that should be Blind people. We’re more attuned to consuming Audio Description as our means of delving into a story and we have more of a legitimate leg up to say something like this voice over artist is super annoying and takes you of the story. The script writer repeated this line twice. At one point in the scene you named this person this and now you’re calling him this. Those kind of things are what we would be more efficient at editing.

TR:

For example, tell me if you think there’s something off with this narration.

[Audio: Shooters Season 2]

This is from season 2 of a Netflix series called “Shooters”. No offense to the Narrator but why in the world is he practically singing every line. I had to abandon the series. I just couldn’t do it. This guy!

CC:

There is room for more employment for visually impaired and Blind people. It’s just a matter of the same that it every was which is unfortunately we have to break down the barriers. We have to be the ones to say , no like we can edit, we can be involved in this, we can be voice artist, like it can happen.

TR:

Colleen is currently a member of an ACB Committee tasked to create an AD Accreditation. They’re developing guidelines that define audio description and requirements for live theater, plays, movies and television.

CC:

It’s not just for the describers, we’re also going to be creating a certification for quality control or consumers of Audio Description. My goal is to make sure that Blind and visually impaired people have a chance to also be certified as quality control and as description consultants.

TR:

When it comes to standards and guidelines for creating Audio Description, there’s a lot of room for growth. How to handle diversity is just one question.

CC:

How much do you say about a person? How do you very quickly categorize somebody if you need a really short term for this one burly guy?What do you say? What’s appropriate to say? What terms are you going to use that may in five in a year, may be no longer appropriate?

A lot of times you may want to reference something, but the main default as far as guidelines will most likely be only if it’s relevant to the story do you need to reference something and then you need to keep in mind you have to reference for everybody because that’s why it would be significant.

TR:

To learn more about Audio Description Training Retreats you can reach them on Facebook or Twitter @ADRetreats or visit ADTrainingRetreats.com.

They have some trainings taking place this fall so go on over to the site and get all the information.

[TR in conversation with CC:]

And your podcast? The name and where can folks take a listen?

CC:

My personal kind of podcast and any of my videos and information can be found at BlindInspirationCast.com

TR:

I’ll have all of these links at ReidMyMind.com on the episodes post.

Shout out to Colleen Connor for taking the time to speak with me for this episode.

I think we may hear from her again in the future regarding AD and more. She and I have some things in common. For example, like when I asked her to try using headphones during our interview and I noticed she too like me enjoys making up songs about nothing.

CC:

Humming a tune…

“Getting my headset!”

[TR in conversation with CC:]

Laughs!

# Closing

TR:

Hey, I’m not sure if you all know this but right now, there’s an incredible sale taking place just about wherever podcasts are distributed.

It costs nothing, absolutely nada, free 99 to subscribe to a podcast including this one. So do yourself a favor and…

Subscribe!
Apple Podcast, Spotify, Google Podcast, Stitcher, Tune In Radio or wherever you get podcasts.

You can always send me feedback or recommend a guest or topic all you have to do is hollaback!

We have the comments section on the blog, ReidMyMind.com.
The email; ReidMyMindRadio@gmail.com
The Reid My Mind Radio Feedback Line where you can leave a voice mail: 1 570-798-7343

I would really love voice messages that I can share on the podcast. If you don’t want to call, you can grab your smart phone and record a voice memo and email the finished recording to ReidMyMindRadio@gmail.com.

I’d love to hear and share the voices of those who are listening. If you want to send a message but don’t want it shared just say so and it’s all good.

I appreciate you listening and if you liked what you heard please rate and even review the show via Apple Podcast. And please, tell a friend to listen. Spread the love, man!

You can always visit www.ReidMyMind.com, that’s R to the E I D like my last name!

Audio: Reid My Mind Radio Outro

Peace!

Hide the transcript

On the Mic with Roy Samuelson

Wednesday, January 30th, 2019

Picture of Roy Samuelson
Continueing the #AudioDescription conversation this time with Voice Over Artist and AD Narrator Roy Samuelson. Hear about his start in the business, more about the process of creating Audio Description from his perspective and our shared enthusiasm for the subject.

We’re talking;
* Process – can Blind and Low Vision Narrators participate?
* Normalization vs. Diversity – Is there room for non-white voices?
* Technology & other opportunities for growth in the field and more…

Listen

Resources

Transcript

Show the transcript

RS:
My name is Roy Samuelson, I’m a Voice Over Artist.

Audio: Multiple demos of Roy’s voice over work.

TR:
That’s up next, right here with me T. Reid
your host and producer of this podcast, Reid My Mind Radio!

Audio: Reid My Mind Radio theme Music

TR:

In 2018 I published some thoughts on Audio Description. That was followed up with an additional conversation on the subject. Today we’re continuing this exploration of Audio Description or AD. This time from the perspective of Voice Over artist and AD Narrator Roy Samuelson.

First, Roy answers the question, what exactly is a voice over

RS:

Voice over is anything you hear with a voice. That could be in a video game a character that’s talking. A commercial where someone’s introducing a product. A promo where there’s a T.V. show being advertised, someone’s introducing when it’s going to be on and what channel.

TR:
As a kid, Roy and his class was assigned the task of interviewing anyone they wanted.

RS:

I wanted to interview someone att eh radio station. When I went there one of the first things the announcer showed me was how to angle the mic so the p’s won’t pop and I thought that was the most amazing thing I had ever seen in my life. Laughs!
This little adjustment could make such a difference. So my curiosity was definitely started then.

TR:

That curiosity along with some additional experience helped lead Roy to voice over.

In his early 20’s he landed a job with then Disney’s MGM Studios theme park in Orlando Florida.

DisneyJob

RS:

I would take over as a gangster and take the audience through all of the scary scenes in movies. I’d have a microphone and in between shooting things I’d be narrating what was going on around the place.
Every 6 to 8 minutes I’d get blown up and start the thing again. So it kind of became like an exercise in just building the skill of talking to people who are paying attention to the story that they’re seeing. That kind of introduced me to voice over.

[TR in conversation with RS:]
What makes a good voice over artist?

There’s a bunch of different opinions. I like to see voice over as a form of acting. It’s a character whether it’s a narrator, a character in a cartoon or even just a commercial. It’s a character telling a story and being part of a story and sharing that with people.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

Do you have a background in acting as well?

RS:

I do yeah. I took a lot of improv classes. In school I had a lot of opportunities on stage and that’s really helped a lot.

TR:

That acting experience eventually landed Roy in a script writers group.
These meetings brought together professional script writers seeking feedback from actors who would cold read their scripts. Meaning, there was no preparation on the part of the actors.

RS:

We would read the characters and read the description and afterward the feedback was all about the writing. So the spotlight was definitely on the script and not the actors and I felt that was so enjoyable. I could play and I could have fun do these ice cold readings without a lot of preparation. The more times I practiced, the more experienced I got with cold reading. When I found out about audio description it seemed like a real segue way from what I had been doing at the script writes and even as far back as that Disney job along with all the other voice over work that I’ve been doing. It felt like a right fit.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

So how did you actually find out about Audio Description?

RS:

A friend of mine referred me and I didn’t literally knock on the door, but I knocked on the door for about two or three years just letting them know I was available and strongly interested and the response was well we’re kind of booked up right now we got everyone we need but thank you for checking in. It wasn’t a brush off it’s just that’s where it was. Every now and again there would be an opportunity where I could fill in for someone and I did. It was so exciting and so much fun and I said thank you so much any other time please let me know, oh sure we’ll let you know. Another year passed . It took a little while.

TR:

In order to get better insight on how Audio Description is made, I asked Roy to walk us through the process
from his perspective.

RS

Audio: Upbeat music…

The scripts are pre-written by, they’re called Describers.

I call myself a Narrator, Audio Description Narrator.

The scripts come to me pre-written and in it are obviously the words that I say. There’s a bunch of queues that tell me when I say what I say. For example, a queue could be time code, where I’m watching the screen and reading the script at the same time and on the screen there’s a time code (like a stop watch). When it gets to a certain point in time that’s my queue to start talking.

there’s visual cues or audio queues. Sometimes it’s the last few words of dialog that the character is saying. It could be even a pause between a long section that I’m speaking. First two sentences then there’s a 2 or 3 second pause before I start speaking again. There’s all sorts of different queues that they use.

TR:

Process makes production efficient. But
they can also unintentionally exclude people from
participating.
Visual cues for example could limit a blind Audio
Description Narrator’s ability to independently function in
such a position.
When I asked if laying down all of the voice over work and
editing at the appropriate time positions was an option,
Roy explained further.

RS:

That could be a way. I’m on a few one hour shows, when we’re all in sync and the script is ready, we’re able to finish in about an hour. They give me four hours total, just in case something can come up . For the most part, it’s not real time but it’s pretty close to real time.

TR:

Watching over the entire recording process is the AD Director. Familiar with the script, they’re listening for any mistakes including mispronunciations and time overlaps.

[TR in conversation with RS:]
So you’re sitting there watching the time code and reading the script, what happens if you go a little longer? Is it just okay, take two?

RS:

If there’s one line that I did not speak quickly enough and the last few words and maybe the last few syllables are spilling over to dialog , as you know that’s not fun for an audience member. They do their best to adjust it either by having me go a little faster or they try to change the words or they even slip the audio that I recorded and make it slide in to fit just perfectly.

TR:

Fully aware that Roy’s responsibility in the process is voicing the narration, I still had to ask;

[TR in conversation with RS:]

How do they determine which narrator is right for a movie or project?

RS:

That’s a great question. I’m learning, I’m definitely on the action adventure horror side of things. (Laughs…) You know with Criminal Minds, the upcoming Girl in the Spider’s Web, the Inspector, Jurassic World. This is the genre that is pretty narration heavy and I do my best to go as quickly as possible without sounding fast. I’ve done some other projects that are more wonderful in the sense of awe inspiring, kind of take it all in sort of thing. Those are the sorts of things that I been cast. That’s something they know I can do and I would think the people that make the decision it makes it easier for them. Oh yeh, this is something Roy’s already done before.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

One that I talked about and this was my personal opinion was Black Panther. So Black Panther ended up being voiced by what sounds like a British White Man.

RS:

Oh!

[TR in conversation with RS:]
For me as the consumer, I thought it was a little disruptive…

RS:

Sure!
[TR in conversation with RS:]

… to the whole feel and aura of the movie.

RS:

Yeh! Absolutely.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

I ended up hearing from some other people who said that same British person voiced Captain America. They were like, I didn’t like the fact that it was a British guy voicing Captain America. People felt a little upset by that. What is taken into consideration when these choices are made?

RS:
Oh it’s so exciting I have so many things I want to talk to you about with
this.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

Okay!

RS:

I remember there’s a quote by Shonda Rhymes where she talked about normalizing instead of diversifying. I’m seeing so many femal voices, people of color voices all sorts of opportunities. I hate to say it, the stereotypical white male voice that has been so common is now not as common which is great. I think there’s many more opportunities different voices to be in this. I think it can only help the story. I think you named two really great examples. When you’re in a story you don’t want to be interrupted. So when the audio description comes in it shouldn’t be out of left field.

I do think these companies are more aware of the content of the story being told and they’re taking a lot of consideration into that.

[TR in conversation with RS:]
That’s good to hear.

[TR in conversation with RS:]
One of my complaints in terms of the script and how things are determined, what are you going to describe? So if I go back to Black Panther, there was a very interesting thing that I found out because it was being discussed. It was not included in the description at all it came up like months after on a radio program I was listening to. They went into more description about the spaceship. I guess in one of the angles when the ship came down, they said how it resembled an African mask.

RS:

Hmmm! (In understanding.)

[TR in conversation with RS:]

They all look different but I get a real sense of that. Plus the fact that the spaceship was created like that , that blew my mind! But I never got access to that information.

RS:

Oh!! (In further understanding.)

[TR in conversation with RS:]

So there was a decision made. Someone didn’t think that was important. So this is why I’m always wondering well at some point it seems to me that the writers of the description should be the writers of the movie.

RS:
Oh, I see.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

They have the vision right? the Director, they’re the ones making these decisions . So some of that information of what they want that consumer to feel , whoever that consumer is Blind or sighted, that should be passed along and so I always wonder, are there conversations between the audio description company and the actual producers and writers of the film. And it doesn’t seem like it. Maybe on like an independent.

RS:

I’m not sure which film it was, but I know it was a big budget film, they definitely cared about to make sure the audio description was heard and they brought in the team. I was brought back and recorded some lines that were very nuanced.

So I think there is a genuine care for the audience for audio description. I’m not going to make a generalized blanket statement on that but I think there are people who are involved outside of audio description but still want to care about the things that you’re talking about.

I’m not sure if Haunting on Hill house on Netflix is described. There’s an element of that series, after 10 episodes I was kind of familiar with the story line. There was an element that was shared on line and as soon as I heard it it was so obvious. It was one of those things like aw wow I didn’t even notice that.

But I think what you’re talking about, back to the Black Panther spaceship is that with audio description we are limited to … if a picture is worth a thousand words , there’s 24 frames per second you know it’s like… I’m not defending it but it definitely is selective. The audio description is by its very nature limited. I’d be curious if there is a way to have like I’m just brainstorming here but out takes or something else that goes deeper into the story to allow those visual elements. How exciting that would be.

[TR in conversation with RS:]

I think there is.

For the Audio Description experience part of it is so so frustrating. It has nothing to do with what you all are doing, it’s the technical side. When you go to a movie theater chances are they’re giving you either the wrong device or the device doesn’t work. So you have to run back over and find a manager. And in my case it’s always my wife. She moves a lot faster than I’m going to move so she’s doing it! Boom, boom, boom! And I feel terrible. I feel awful because she’s missing that part of the movie, but she doesn’t want me to experience it without it.
There’s all this time during the promos. Those aren’t described so I’m usually bored. It would also be a test of the technology because if the right track is coming through that’s telling you about the movie, then you know your stuff is working, you technology is working. This is exactly what they do in a show, like a Broadway show. They introduce you to the cast beforehand. They describe their costumes, they let you get acclimated to their voices, they’ll describe the set. All of that is done before the show. So I think like hey, why not put that out beforehand. Yes the movie is limited to that time, but the experience really does go past that time.

RS:

Wow!

TR:

Listening back to our conversation, I realize a few things.

First, I think I get a little enthusiastic about the subject.

Secondly, I referred to the issues encountered in theaters when using AD only as a technical problem. And while yes sometimes the problems arise from the technology, more than often I feel as though the problems stem from uninformed theater workers.

I’m still trying to figure out why when you let them know you’re Blind and want to use the Audio Description device they translate that to mean you want the device for the hearing impaired.

Come to find out, Roy is familiar with this faulty part of the process.

RS:

My mom wanted to watch a screening with audio description, same thing happened. It didn’t work. The exciting thing with that is the manager found out apologized profusely , they said it was a glitch . There’s other technology coming out. I want to say Acti View?

[TR in conversation with RS:]
Yes Sir!

TR:
Acti View is the app that allows audio description consumers as well as those using captions and enhanced audio, with the means of directly downloading their access solution. For more on this service and how it came to be, check out the episode where we speak to one of the founders.

RS:
That kind of stuff is starting to happen. I can’t help but think that this is an opportunity. The popularity of podcasts, audio books and how easily accessible those are for this audio description is kind of in the same world. Commuters who happened to be sighted can enjoy the experience of audio description and that can only help the audience get more opportunities that look forward to enjoying it.

Aw I’m so excited.

TR:

It was nice to hear that Roy and I share a mutual excitement for Audio Description. It made for a good conversation.

Not only did I appreciate hearing his enthusiasm for the subject, listening to him accentuates his ability to employ several styles in his narration work. Roy says he tailors his voice to the genre.

RS:

I gotta be part of the stories. I can’t sound happy and joyous all the time. Laughs…

TR:

Next time you’re enjoying a television show or movie with Audio Description and you find yourself thinking that voice sounds familiar. there’s only one way to be certain. Wait until the end of the credits and you hear;

Audio: Read by Roy Samuelson. (Audio Description from “Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom”)

TR:

You can connect with Roy on social media;
On Twitter @RoySamuelson and
on Facebook you can find him as Roy Samuelson Biz or
visit Roy Samuelson.com

Audio bumper

Audio Description isn’t new. The lack of AD in movies and television programming over the years since its creation amounts to exclusion.

The result, many in the Blind and Low Vision community feel as though movies are just not for them.

In 2019 however, there’s lots of reasons to give television and movies with audio description a try.

We have
the 21st Century Telecommunications Act on our side – leading to more content.
And we have multiple accessible ways of consuming that content.

. If you haven’t yet experienced AD either at home or in a theater , I urge you to give it a try.

It’s not just entertaining television and movies, more documentaries are including description. Something I’m personally happy to see.

The process of making video accessible shouldn’t itself be inaccessible to the community it seeks to serve. Blind and low vision people should have access to these opportunities.

Blind people come from all backgrounds. We’re Black, Hispanic, Asian, Native as well as white. We’re straight, gay, lesbian transgender. As we call for television and movies to be more reflective of our society so should the voices that describe these movies to us.

How do you feel about Audio description?
Holla back!
We have the comments section on the blog, ReidMyMind.com.
The email; ReidMyMindRadio@gmail.com
The Reid My Mind Radio Feedback Line where you can leave a voice mail: 1 570-798-7343

I would really love voice messages that I can share on the podcast. If you don’t want to call, you can grab your smart phone and record a voice memo and email the finished recording to ReidMyMindRadio@gmail.com.

I’d love to hear and share the voices of those who are listening. If you want to send a message but don’t want it shared just say so and it’s all good.

We’re going to continue to explore Audio Description as we move through 2019. So my best advice for you to make sure you don’t miss that and everything else in store…

Subscribe!
Apple Podcast, Spotify, Google Podcast Sound Cloud, Stitcher, Tune In Radio or wherever you get podcasts.
Visit www.ReidMyMind.com

So there’s no confusion, that’s R to the E I D like my last name!

Audio: Dramatic closing music from Jurassic World, Falling Kingdom RS: “Cut to Black”

Audio: RMMRadio Outro Theme

TR:

Peace

Hide the transcript

Reid My Mind Radio: Doctor Dre’s The Fight Back

Wednesday, March 15th, 2017

Picture of Doctor Dre, seated with a tan fur jacket with the caption, Doctor Dre The Fight Back!

Doctor Dre of Yo MTV Raps, NYC’s Hot 97 Morning Show, the movie Who’s the Man? And so much more … is launching The Fight Back!

Diagnosed with Type 2 Diabetes and now blind, this fight back is about more than you probably think.

This episode features the piece produced for Gatewave radio followed by more personal conversation with Dre. Plus, you know there’s only one way to intro this podcast… if you were a morning show listener you know I had to do it…it’s the roll call!

So c’mon yawl, listen to Dre…
>scroll down a bit, , to hear the show press play!

 

Resources:

 

Transcript

Show the transcript


TR:
What’s good everybody?
This is a special episode so I’m going to jump right in…
it’s no mystery , the title of the episode says it all.

If you’re in my age group You remember when older folks said rap was a fad and
black radio didn’t play the music!

You remember when MTV played videos and they weren’t black artists let alone rap music.

Yes, this episode is featuring that Doctor Dre from YoMTV Raps and many other things like the Hot 97 morning show.
With that in mind! There’s only one way for me to kick-off the podcast…

Yeah, I’m gonna do it!

[Audio: From The Hot 97 Morning Show with Ed, Lisa & Dre
Music…
“What’s up yawl, whatcha got to say, who’s on the phone with Ed, Lisa & Dre?”]

TR:
Yo, TReid’s the name, and right now’s the time
Welcome to the podcast called Reid My Mind!

Cheah!

[Reid My Mind Intro]

TR:
Significant vision loss can force a person to face real doubts and questions.
Such as;
Why did this happen to me?
What do I do now?

Andre Brown has chosen to answer the last question by launching a fight;
well really a fight back.

It’s more than vision loss.

In  2008 Andre was diagnosed with type 2 Diabetes.

He experienced multiple complications of the disease including Charco – foot Syndrome which he says can cause a collapse of the ankle.

DD:
My vision loss came as a progression of that and not taking care of myself properly.

my vision loss was a gradual thing where I  started seeing little things across my vision. Little lines and you know things jumping.

TR:
After These lines often called floaters,  multiple surgeries to repair detached retinas,
Andre was left with some light perception.

DD:
Diagnosed as Diabetic Retinopathy but  as the Doctor said  to me , he said that’s what’s   blocking your vision, you have scar tissue in the back. He said we can’t do anything about  it until we stop the Diabetes. So once that happens then  we can do a different procedure or two to see if we can make the sight  come back.
I’ve spoken with a lot of different people and everyone has told me that my sight  returning is a very strong possibility, especially with what I am doing now.

TR:
What he’s doing now?
Simply put, he’s fighting back!

This fight is just as much for others as it is for himself.

Andre’s in a unique position to take on this job.
You see he’s been working in support of the careers of others for years.

Andre Brown, is better known as Doctor Dre, a pioneer  in Hip Hop culture and entertainment.

Starting out in WBAU, the Adelphi University radio station in Long Island,
Doctor Dre would eventually go on to record music with his group Original Concept.

He D Jayed for the Beastie Boys.

He was involved in getting one of Hip Hop’s most prolific and influential groups, Public Enemy on to Def Jam records.

Most people know him as part of the Ed Lover and Doctor Dre Duo who
hosted “Yo MTV Raps” every weekday
between 1989 and 1995; As well as
extremely successful radio morning shows in New York City between 1993 and 1998.

DJ, musician, actor, author… and now
Doctor Dre is  in a position to bring real attention to two of today’s
very significant health crisis ;
Diabetes & Vision loss.

DD:
Well we have the program that’s called Doctor Dre’s The Fight Back.

Taking the situation and being able to talk to other people and say, I can show you through  what I’m going through  that we all can change. We all can grow.

I’m finding other people that have different or similar experiences and being able to share that. So the fight back is
how do we reach out and get so many resources to work with you to try to actually change your situation.

TR:
Changing the situation by providing access to information  including;
medical, lifestyle and technology.

DD:
I’m doing a lot of Holistic medicine along  with traditional medicine to work with my Diabetes  and just to change my diet. Just putting that under better control

I’m playing the Guinea pig so everyone can  see it.

TR   [In conversation with Dre]
When you say   you’re playing the Guinea pig what does that mean?

DD:
Sometimes you have to go out and someone has  to go oh hey does that work, well I’ll try it  let’s see

I’m not bringing guarantees, I’m trying to bring choices.

What we’re doing is trying to bring those choices to the fore front. so there no longer just whispered in a corner or you have to pull this up on the Google thing… know we’re gonna say no, here’s a bunch of things here, find a way to find something that works best for you. Here are some things that are very easily at your beck and call.

And when you have options, there’s so much more you can do.

TR:
Real life style changes that affect the way we think about nutrition.

DD:
And that’s one of my goals in The Fight Back, is to change bad thinking.  The mother of 4 who works three  jobs with four kids and they have to run to McDonald’s because they  want those Happy Meals; I want to change the Happy Meal to a life meal.

TR:
Lifestyle choices are like adjusting to vision loss; it’s personal.

DD:
you do what you feel the most comfortable doing  and you work from that position. Everybody’s an individual about it. There’s no one magic thing for one person. There’s a lot of great things out there and I  am discovering those things to help  me accomplish doing other things. I’m very open to learning.

TR [In Conversation]:
What types of things are you discovering?

DD:
I have a phone I could talk to and it  speaks and dials  and talks to me.

The technology now is catching up. I believe like Netflix has where they actually have  a program that is designed so when you’re watching a program it describes everything so you get the full affect.
I’m discovering it one at a time but I don’t know the name of everything I just go wow that exists , that’s a good idea, that’s a really good idea.

TR [In Conversation with Dre]:
that’s Audio Description.

DD:
Yes.

TR [In Conversation with Dre]:
Just for full disclosure, I’m blind myself.

DD:
Oh, ok!

TR [In Conversation with Dre]:
The experience is unique and different for everyone. So I’m trying to gauge what is your experience and how other people can relate and learn… whatever that is because that’s what experience is all about. There for everyone.
DD:
Exactly.

Well with me I understood simply when it was starting to happen  I said don’t panic.
I’ve become a person that reaches for solutions. And rather than falling into , oh my god I can’t believe this is happening  and go into depressed mode I said no  this may happen, this is what you may need to prepare to start doing. And I started preparing myself for it. I said you know what I said you know what  this may be, but darkness  won’t last forever. I said  you have God behind you  and God has already told you  this isn’t forever, this is to slow you down  this is just to make sure  that you can listen and hear what I have to say. And I started listening and hearing what he had to say  more than I started talking.

I embrace it. And in embracing it he has put me on a path  to help other people and to reach out and express myself not  just about the type 2 Diabetes not only about the blindness but  about when something goes on and there’s a struggle sometimes embrace your struggle to find your solutions.
It doesn’t mean it’s a guarantee for a cure or a guarantee to a perfect answer  but what it does is says you know what  I’m more than what’s going on with me.
I can also work with this.

If you have a good relationship with your family, friends and  other people and reaching out. I learn every day from so many different people  and I pay attention and I  try to pass on some of the knowledge of what I get  so that people can help themselves

TR:
The Fight Back is a give and take; a collaboration.

TR [In conversation with Dre]:
So what is The Fight Back, what does that look like? in the world. Is that like a  web portal

DD:
It’s going to be a website… we’re building as we speak because I didn’t want to just put something out there … like it’s easy to say we’re going to do that  and throw it out there and  people just think that’s it, that’s it… no so I said , first thing we’ll do  is I’ll go out and start talking , build different interviews up and now it’s starting to take different testimonials  from different people  and it’s attached to other situations  also , you know I’m working with  a friend of mind from a company called Rally Wing and they had family who had diabetes and their discussing stuff with me.

Another gentlemen by the name of Marvin Mizell who is Jam Master Jay’s brother  has a company called JMJ Foundation  for the youth. He has Sickle Cell and Diabetes so connecting with his thing. there’s a bunch of people that I have connected with  and I said you know what maybe I should be that focal point to bring people together. and see if we can actually work, not just to a cure and better treatments ,but to better understanding  and better conversations

So going out now and talking to different people and listening to what their saying  how they fought back
that’s what this fight back is all about.

Bring those stories to light.
Bring this action to light!
And be a little educational, be a little entertaining, be informative, and be supportive
That’s where the strength is!

TR [In conversation with Dre]:
Is the reality show still a thing?

DD:
We went out there we talked to different places, everyone was excited, yeh we want to do this, yes Dre we love it. And as more we kept talking, my idea disappeared and it became this other thing. It was like that’s not what we’re talking about .

I have a little experience in creating television programs.
We’re creating our own show. Creating our own messaging, making our own venue because the technology allows us to do this.

How do we take all these different instances and work together. Instead of just having a website, a page, you know do this  and get this. No, I want you to come on, I want you to see these different testimonials to be able to reach out to like you and to say hey I want you to talk to him because your experience can help some other people. Your conversation can help someone else who may be feeling down and go hey wow it isn’t as bad as I thought or it could be really bad so we’re going to try and reach out. Go see people shake hands, kiss babies, do whatever needs to be done. We’re going to run the ultimate campaign! The campaign of life of wellness and happiness. That’s a campaign where you just can’t be elected. there is no electoral college for that!

TR [In conversation with Dre]:
[Laughing!!]

DD:
I’m sorry! I’m so sorry!

TR [In conversation with Dre]:
Don’t apologize for that. That’s real!
[Laughing!]

DD:
My things are based on love
People want to sit back and talk about this guys this and this one’s that. Hate, hate!
I said, you know what man, hate carries weight! With love you can soar!
And I got nothing but love man!

TR:
When the site is completed, you will be able to learn more at Doctor Dre TFB.com.

There’s a quote I like to refer to that’s attributed to a Greek philosopher or motivational speaker depending on who you believe…
It’s not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters.

Doctor Dre,  reacting with love
to make information more easily available , bring
health choices to the forefront,  create a place where
others can share their experiences, all while
remaining faithful and encouraging;

In this fight, there can be only one winner; nothing but love!

This is Thomas Reid, for Gatewave Radio;

Inserted from DD:
“Bring those stories to light. Bring this action to light! And be a little educational, be a little entertaining.”

Audio for independent living!

[Audio: Dre drop a load on em’, from “You down with MTV”]

TR:

Podcasts allow for longer exploration and intimate conversation.
In a way, I hinted to this in the Gatewave story edit.

There’s power in conversation between two people
exchanging knowledge about their shared experience.

Some things you really only feel comfortable talking about with someone who you know gets what you’re saying.
You don’t want to have to explain yourself.

The conversation could just be two people kicking around philosophical ideas.

often it’s , just talking about real practical sharing of information.
Like when Dre mentioned posting to Facebook:

DD:
One of my friends growing up he said I saw you on Facebook and I’m going how is he doing this? Isn’t he blind? And he’s like, he’s actually posting and doing this and that… I said, I have somebody doing that. The way I post is my son posts for me. He’ll put stuff up  that I need written or said or whatever we want to put on my Facebook page. So that’s fine. That’s how that works.

TR [In conversation with Dre]
You could do it yourself too you know right?

DD:
Please, I’m listening

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Ok so you have the iPhone and the app on the iPhone is , I mean it’s all accessible. It sounds like you mainly probably use Siri, the dictation?

DD:
Yes, I use Siri right now.

TR [In conversation with Dre]
So  you don’t use the keyboard at all, you never tried to use the keyboard?

DD:
No!  (Surprised!)

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Oh, you can absolutely. Do you have Voice Over turned on?

DD:
You know what,  I’ve been trying to go to the Apple store to sit there and have them explain everything that can be done , I do not probably have it turned on, no.

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Ok!

TR:
Sometimes we assume that people are supposed to just know things…
Those who do, need to be more open and welcoming in order to make that information available.
At the same time remain open to receiving new ideas.

Three words that tell me Dre is going to be fine
no matter what the end result of his vision loss turns out to be;

DD:
“Please, I’m listening!”

TR:
Please, I’m listening!

Dre doesn’t know me.
He’s been around the world and has access to people and privilege.

DD:
Having reached out to people like Stevie Wonder.

TR:
Now, who am I to challenge something that Stevie says. I only say that because what Stevie means to me.

Adjusting to blindness though, is different from living with blindness all your life.

For example, I grew up only seeing out of one eye.
The challenge to me was different compared to someone who loses an eye
later in life and never had monocular vision.
I could share some information about things they should know,
but prior to blindness I wouldn’t have been able to relate to that loss.
That adjustment is the challenge. Growing up only knowing one thing is a different experience.

Meanwhile, I too could probably benefit from some of their discoveries.

Dre knows there’s so much more to learn and is open to that information for himself and others.

Our conversation though, went deeper.

Like when I wanted  Dre to know about an aspect of blindness
that is experienced and the ramifications that are felt by too many.

TR [In conversation with Dre]

We started the conversation with a little bit about  blindness and with the things people do and do not know, right. There’s all this technology, there’s so much you know going on and one of the big big issues  when it comes down to the blind community . The image of people who are blind in terms of how that’s perceived in society,  there’s a lot of negative connotation when it comes to blindness that I realized that I had and as I met other people  you know, blind at birth or blind afterward, there’s an incredible resource out here that is not being taken advantage of. So within the blindness community and within the disability community, unemployment is 70 percent.

DD:
Yes, it is!

TR:
So many people don’t even understand that. Even in just in terms of how people can do things and the abilities that are there it’s just not known. In part of what you’re doing you may not have or may have thought about it, you are going to be a representative  of that to some degree. Whether or not you like it or not, right, people are going to look at you and they now look you as he’s blind and therefore when they think of other people who are blind they will think of you. And so the things that you’re doing are going to send a positive message  not only to people who are sighted but also to other people who are blind who may have  bought into that.

I just ask you to ponder that, you know!

DD:
I hear what you’re saying. It’s very funny that you say those things. Funny not laughing wise, funny as it’s very interesting how we do that … I now the same way  I was put upon  and told do you believe you can get your sight back, I’m going to ask you those questions to… do you believe you can get your sight back?

TR:
Now, I had lots of people say they were hoping and praying I get my sight back, but
No one outside my immediate family has ever directly asked me that question.

I know a lot of people might think that question shouldn’t have been asked.
But it was part of our conversation so in no way was I offended or upset by that. This was a conversation between two people experiencing vision loss.

This isn’t some random person asking me on the street.

My answer and Dre’s response forced me to think about how I look at that question.

My answer… next time on Reid My Mind Radio!

[Laughing….]

Just playing!

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Nah! My situation is totally different.

DD:
Mmm hmmm!

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Number 1 my cancer is a genetic cancer. I was born  with a cancer called Retinoblastoma. I lost my left eye  as a child. The tumor overtook that eye.  I had at that time, this was in 68, well 69, radiat5ion. Thirty five years later that radiation caused another huge tumor  to grow in the back of my right eye and so I had no real choice because it was right on the optic nerve and so when it’s on that optic nerve, the next step is the brain So my choice was do I take that out  and live? Now mind you my wife was pregnant with our second child, we just moved from the Bronx to the Poconos in a house… so my right eye was removed.  There’s no coming back from that.

DD:
Ahh, yes.  You can’t get an eye transplant?

TR:
No, there’s no such thing as an eye transplant. The amount of nerves  that are in the eye  is unlike any place else. But that’s ok!  I didn’t have a choice and that’s ok, you know because I  my family, I have my little girls you know and so  my thing was like you  stepping back from the industry, my thing was I’m raising my girls you know. I’m a keep working and do whatever I can and be a  you know a help to other people  be a you know, productive member of society  and all of that and I can do that when I’m blind. I like to say the only thing I can’t do is drive.

DD:
Well that tells me a funny story that  I thrown out to Stevie Wonder about doing a movie I used to tell when I was doing interviews and I still do but know people go like you’re really going to do that and I said yeah I’m going to do that. I was being interviewed and they said Dre you gonna do any more movies and I said yeah I’m going to do movies. I said right now I’m in conversation with Stevie Wonder , we’re doing this movie called Just Drive the Damn Bus! And everyone fell out. They said for real. I said yeah and in that movie you’re going to see  Stevie and I drive the bus.

TR:
Uh huh!

DD:
They were like, how are you going to do that?  I said that’s the point, you gotta see the movie. And I was joking about it right?And then I started working with  one of my partners and we started  coming up with a concept of the movie and  it was like, this could work. I said, it’s a movie! I said, but do you understand what would happen and he said  but how are you guys going to act in the movie? I said  the same way other people act  in a movie, you hit your mark, you say your lines you keep moving, that’s not an issue.

TR:
Right.

DD:
Stop making an issue of a non-issue.  And then I told, a matter of fact I told  I was talking to LL Cool j and I told him about it and he  fell out laughing. He said you’re serious. I said I’m dead serious, your gonna do that.
I don’t walk around with dark glasses on. My son says Dad put the glasses on  stop walking around… I said no people need to see my eyes the way they are. So what, it doesn’t matter.
I say this to say this to you. We may not know the technology that will exist to help you gain sight when you need it, but I believe in my heart with what you just told me and what just trinkled through me is you and I our meeting is not coincidental  and I can’t promise this, but I just have this feeling  in my gut you’re gonna get your sight, because you need to see your kids.

TR [In conversation with Dre]
[Exhales!]

DD:
I know you’re saying, how can that be done? I don’t know. I don’t have that answer yet. That answer may come next year, that may come in five years, we don’t know. When I put those goals in front of me  it gives me something to shoot for. Reality or not, that’s why I say  that thing about the movie,  just drive the damn bus… Bill said, you are nuts, you’re outta you… I said no I’m not. I said because we can do anything if you put your mind to it.  Remember seeing Star Trek the Next generation

TR [In conversation with Dre]

yeah, yeah, with Jody…

DD:
LaVar Burton! He put on a visor and  he could see. But when he went to do the movies  LaVar didn’t want that visor on his face they pulled it off and put something on his eyes…we don’t know what’s coming!

TR [In conversation with Dre]
Right!

DD
Now if I could get in a DeLorean and go sixty years forward and grab it and pull it back  and say here put this on it works

TR [In conversation with Dre]
[Laughing….]

DD:
I don’t know!

TR [In conversation with Dre]

Right, right!

DD:
But we’re back to what the Fight Back is all about, choices!

TR [In conversation with Dre]

What you just said  helped me because the obstacles in front of me are not  necessarily just based on sight. And that goes into a really deeper conversation, but when you said  you get something from  that, there’s no way  I would want to take that away from you!

TR:
I’m not a dream killer and never want to be that!

Believing in the ability to regain sight doesn’t mean  not believing in the abilities of people who are blind.

Often though, that seems to be the message we hear from different organization in their fight against blindness.

The NY Times a few weeks ago ran an article with the headline;
The Worst that Could Happen? Going Blind, People Say
The article itself discussed some of the fears, and ways to prevent or slow
certain types of eye diseases, but
it did nothing to help ease that fear for
those who are facing  that in their present or future.

That’s not cool!

They only looked at vision loss from the medical perspective  ,
prevent the disease and there’s no longer an issue!

But there’s the society side!

That fear is what leads to people not wanting to in anyway associate themselves with blindness.
That fear and miseducation leads to that 70 percent unemployment.

But Dre’s not saying that.
His approach appears to be inclusive, holistic as in a full picture.

He’s straight up keeping his options open
I can support that!

Let’s do some shout outs!

First of all Doctor Dre,
thank you brother for the conversation,
for the courage and willingness to bring options to the people!
I hope to hear more about the Fight Back in the near future.

These next two shout outs come with a recommendation…
Audio: The Cipher Show theme[]

If you are a hip hop fan and like to hear background stories
from artists, journalists and those on the business side…
you need to check the cipher show.
Host Shawn Satero was kind enough to help make this interview happen.

It’s one of my favorite podcasts.

At least once every episode you will hear a person being interviewed say, Wow, you really did your research!”

you’ll hear it at least once an episode which lets you know it’s a quality show.

Shout out to Shawn and the Cipher show!

Shout out to Bill Adler who helped coordinate this with Dre.
BTW, Sir, please continue producing that Christmas  Mix Tape,
my daughter and I look forward to that Cipher episode each year.
No comments folks, I like the different cultural Christmas music and I ain’t ashamed to say it!

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Got feedback?
Hit me at reidmymindradio@gmail.com … Remember Reid, is R E I D.

Thanks for listening!

Peace!

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